48. Tuscany, Italy: The Good, the Bad and the Itchy

Ep48.

Download • 217KB

NEW - Quizlet Flashcards: click here for link to vocabulary cards from this episode

[00:00:02.100] - Oliver (Host)

Okay, welcome back to English and Beyond, an advanced-level podcast for learners of English as a foreign language. At the best of times, this episode or this podcast is not one that is highly well-planned nowadays. Instead, I basically talk about whatever I want with César, my regular guest. And today, it's even less well-structured than usual because we're doing this completely on a whim. We're doing this, we're flying by the seats of our pants, and we're just going to talk about whatever we think about because we are here and inspired by the beautiful Tuscan countryside. So César, how are you?

[00:00:40.180] - César (Guest)

Yeah, I'm good. I'm relaxed after four days here. We're going back home today and I'm glad we came. It was really relaxing. It was my second time in Tuscany, but the first time that I really enjoyed the, the -

[00:00:54.420] - Oliver (Host)

Experience?

[00:00:54.700] - César (Guest)

Scenery, all the views, food.

[00:00:57.940] - Oliver (Host)

What happened the other times?

[00:00:58.710] - César (Guest)

We went to the beach. No, the first time, I had only been once here. It was for our friend's wedding.

[00:01:04.930] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, I'm not even sure it was in Tuscany. We landed in Tuscany, but then we did that thing when you immediately jump into a hire car and drive miles away.

[00:01:13.370] - César (Guest)

No, it was Tuscany because it's actually not far from here. I still have it on my favourites, on Google Maps.

[00:01:17.790] - Oliver (Host)

It's like an hour, though, because I think that's part of the problem with Tuscany. It can not be that far, how the crow flies, but it is incredibly far because the roads are so windy.

[00:01:32.830] - César (Guest)

Windy, you say?

[00:01:33.830] - Oliver (Host)

Windy, winding roads, you can say.

[00:01:35.940] - César (Guest)

Can you say curvy? Or that's only for people?

[00:01:38.310] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, generally for people.

[00:01:39.980] - César (Guest)

Interesting. I'm sure I've used the the adjective curvy to talk about roads.

[00:01:45.340] - Oliver (Host)

I'm sure that native speakers will, too, because the great thing about English is that you can put a Y on the end of anything. And it becomes an adjective. You can say things that are ridiculous and people will understand, like, you know, it's very tree-y around here. There's lots of trees. It's very tree-y.

[00:02:06.450] - César (Guest)

Or treeish.

[00:02:07.420] - Oliver (Host)

Woody, you can say. Well, let's talk a little bit about the reality of being in Tuscany because we've already referenced the roads that are very winding, which - like the Beatles song, Long and Winding Roads, well, Long and Winding Road. It's actually like a Paul McCartney and John Lennon, I think. But there's an example of that adjective in action. I am constantly scratching. Firstly, I haven't got sun tan lotion on, which for most people wouldn't be a problem, but it is a problem for me. So I probably will have to end this episode early to go and put on some sun tan lotion. But I'm also itching myself because of what?

[00:02:47.240] - César (Guest)

Because of the mosquitoes.

[00:02:48.360] - Oliver (Host)

The level, the number of mosquitoes. The number of mosquitoes.

[00:02:49.720] - César (Guest)

Or other insects. We're not completely sure.

[00:02:52.630] - Oliver (Host)

Definitely mosquitoes. Because when we first arrived here, I got bitten pretty much immediately, and they swelled up enormously. I felt like the Hunchback of Notre Dame because I had one on the centre of my back that was just absolutely massive, like a ball.

[00:03:12.550] - César (Guest)

Your immune system was overreacting a bit.

[00:03:14.940] - Oliver (Host)

It was, but you're lucky because yours doesn't react at all.

[00:03:18.330] - César (Guest)

Yeah, because I'm not very appealing for mosquitoes in Tuscany, apparently.

[00:03:22.730] - Oliver (Host)

Well, or maybe it's the immune thing because apparently the reason that it swells up, I don't know that this is true. As always, we say a lot things that we don't know.

[00:03:31.320] - César (Guest)

Disclaimer.

[00:03:31.660] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, the language, fine. The content, who knows? But it's... Apparently, it's because your immune system reacts to the bites and that's what makes it swell. So it might be your immune system just ignores it. It's certainly better that in the four days, the bites that I'm getting now are really minor in comparison to the ones I got at the beginning. Yeah.

[00:03:54.630] - César (Guest)

We're in the middle of the forest or countryside. How would you call this in English?

[00:04:01.290] - Oliver (Host)

This particular bit?

[00:04:03.090] - César (Guest)

With all these trees?

[00:04:05.470] - Oliver (Host)

Well, so you could say, I would say in general, it's the countryside. If you have a limited number of trees, but all collected here like this, you could say it's a grove.

[00:04:14.620] - César (Guest)

A growth?

[00:04:14.920] - Oliver (Host)

A grove of trees. I think that that would be a decent way to describe it.

[00:04:21.350] - César (Guest)

By the way, these trees are very specific because you can probably see on the video that most of the log, the trunk.

[00:04:30.740] - Oliver (Host)

Of the trunk.

[00:04:31.530] - César (Guest)

Most of the trunk has been removed, has been peeled off.

[00:04:35.070] - Oliver (Host)

Interestingly, it's only a log once you've cut it.

[00:04:37.690] - César (Guest)

Okay, so the trunk, yeah. Part of the trunk has been peeled off.

[00:04:41.670] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, up to a certain level. So it's black until a certain level Then it's green-white because that is... What's the stuff up there still?

[00:04:49.170] - César (Guest)

Cork.

[00:04:49.720] - Oliver (Host)

Cork, exactly. So you can see all of the trees have been stripped to a certain level, where they're using the material, the bark, to make cork.

[00:04:57.360] - César (Guest)

To make wine bottles.

[00:05:00.100] - Oliver (Host)

Exactly, because wine is a huge thing here. We're not actually drinking this weekend, sadly, but you don't feel very well. I'm just wanting to take a characteristic break from drinking. But everyone else that we're here with is drinking a lot.

[00:05:13.380] - César (Guest)

They like wine, and they probably appreciate more than us, no, different types of wine.

[00:05:19.870] - Oliver (Host)

Oh, God, yeah, for sure. I mean we have literally - I think you get masteries. I don't know what the actual word would be, but certificates of expertise in wine. You're a wine master, and one of the guys here as a wine master, which is nice because when you go to a restaurant and people always want to delegate the selection of the wine, and I have no idea about it. But, you know, it's very easy because you're like, you choose the wine to this guy.

[00:05:45.440] - César (Guest)

I don't even know how to open a bottle of wine.

[00:05:49.780] - Oliver (Host)

That is true, actually. I am always the one that has to open it if we do drink. That is quite bad.

[00:05:55.180] - César (Guest)

We're not good with wines, but we are good now with olive oil.

[00:05:59.200] - Oliver (Host)

Olive oil.

[00:05:59.700] - César (Guest)

Extra virgin olive oil.

[00:06:00.700] - Oliver (Host)

Because I'd never heard of this. I'd heard of wine tasting, of course, but we actually went to go and see an olive oil tasting where… It's quite funny because in wine, I don't know any British person who in a wine tasting does what you're supposed to do, where you take a sip of the wine, you taste it, and then you spit it out into the bucket, the spit bucket. Everyone I know just drinks it. But so they actually had a spit bucket with the olive oil tasting. But again, I think everyone just drank it. But you have to do this thing. Do you want to imitate what you do when you're actually tasting the olive oil?

[00:06:42.540] - César (Guest)

So you're given a tiny amount of olive oil in a little cup. You bring your mouth and you don't have to swallow it. You have to do this weird sound, just to get it back in your throat. Sometimes it's very - not spicy, but well, sometimes - sometimes it was spicy - the bugs [flying around and irritating him!]. But yeah, it makes you cough, for example.

[00:07:07.760] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, it could do for some of them. A small note on the grammar there, actually, because you said you don't have to…

[00:07:14.160] - César (Guest)

 Swallow it. [Bleep / bleep]

[00:07:14.780] - Oliver (Host)

Wow, that is a big one. I'm going to have to bleep that.

[00:07:20.680] - César (Guest)

It was very scary.

[00:07:22.170] - Oliver (Host)

It wasn't scary. It was a beetle.

[00:07:25.030] - César (Guest)

Was it a beetle?

[00:07:25.890] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah.

[00:07:26.170] - César (Guest)

Okay. I thought it was a hornet or something.

[00:07:28.190] - Oliver (Host)

I don't want to. You can really tell how much from the city you are. How could you think that was a hornet?

[00:07:34.650] - César (Guest)

I don't know. It was big and the sun it was making...

[00:07:36.870] - Oliver (Host)

It was shiny and green. Okay.

[00:07:39.510] - César (Guest)

I thought beetles were black.

[00:07:41.440] - Oliver (Host)

Well, they can be all sorts of colours, can't they? Okay. I mean, now we'll have someone watching who is... I've gotten the word for-

[00:07:47.480] - César (Guest)

Biologist?

[00:07:47.790] - Oliver (Host)

No, there's a specific word for insects, but I've forgotten what it is. I'll put it in the subtitles. [Entomologist!] But I was going to comment on your grammar because you said you take a little bit into your mouth and you don't have to swallow it.

[00:08:03.130] - César (Guest)

You don't need to?

[00:08:04.370] - Oliver (Host)

No, those are both the same things, which is that it's not necessary for you to swallow it, whereas what you want to say is, You mustn't swallow it, or, You need to not swallow it. You need to keep it in your mouth. You need to not swallow it and kind of like swirl it around the mouth a bit. Then you do this weird sound.

[00:08:22.470] - César (Guest)

You like aspirate, like Hoover it.

[00:08:24.370] - Oliver (Host)

Exactly. You Hoover it into the back of your mouth. A little bit like Hannibal Lecter when he does weird kind of like noise. That way you draw out the notes, we call it, for these tastes in wine tasting or olive oil tasting.

[00:08:42.260] - César (Guest)

Anyway, we found out that we need to spend at least €10 per bottle.

[00:08:47.270] - Oliver (Host)

We also found out that it's a waste of time buying Spanish olive oil, according to the Italians.

[00:08:51.110] - César (Guest)

Yeah, according to the Italians, Spanish olive oil is basically cat piss.

[00:08:57.180] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, cat pee.

[00:08:58.720] - César (Guest)

Cat pee.

[00:08:59.820] - Oliver (Host)

Yes.

[00:09:00.910] - César (Guest)

But yeah, it was a good experience.

[00:09:03.730] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, it was really interesting.

[00:09:05.320] - César (Guest)

Now, every time we're in a restaurant here, we're like, What is this olive oil? Is it real?

[00:09:10.930] - Oliver (Host)

Well, this I actually said to her during the olive oil tasting that I'm not sure I want to know very much about it because it seems to me that with wine and with, apparently, olive oil now, if you become too knowledgeable, you learn too much about it, then you cease to be able to appreciate the normal varieties.

[00:09:29.330] - César (Guest)

With food in general, even if you're not a foodie, when you are 18, you don't really care how the quality of the pizza or burger is. But now you've been to enough places to distinguish good quality, bad quality. That's a shame because your standards get higher and higher.

[00:09:48.960] - Oliver (Host)

I think part of that is actually travelling to the countries, when you're old enough and lucky enough to do it, you travel to the countries where these things are from. You can have like pizza in Naples, for example. And we actually have seen that as well because... Well, there's a couple of funny things that we've noticed. Firstly, that obviously all countries change their food in versions of the restaurants abroad. So Chinese food is not the same in the UK as it is in China. They adapt it for British tastes. And they've done that here, where they almost never have given us a little plate for the olive oil that you then dip the bread in. Only a couple of times. Yeah, which we basically have missed because it's apparently a very Spanish or British version of Italian food.

[00:10:44.490] - César (Guest)

I mean, an Italian person told me in the past that that's something that no one does in Italy, that only Italian restaurants outside of Italy do, but I don't know.

[00:10:55.810] - Oliver (Host)

But it's a shame, I think, to not have it because it's actually quite nice. I Obviously, yes, it's adapted for our tastes, but it's actually quite nice to have. I'm missing that. The other thing that I'm really missing as well, and if there are any Tuscans watching, please don't criticise me, but I'm really missing this.

[00:11:12.090] - César (Guest)

They will.

[00:11:13.000] - Oliver (Host)

The what?

[00:11:13.500] - César (Guest)

They will.

[00:11:14.340] - Oliver (Host)

Oh, they will, yeah. No, well, exactly, because like, warning, warning, I'm about to criticise Italian food or Tuscan food. But I really miss salt in bread. Because there's no salt in the bread here.

[00:11:24.780] - César (Guest)

But there is a reason for that.

[00:11:26.480] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, the idea is that... Well, why don't you explain that?

[00:11:28.580] - César (Guest)

I actually don't know. I don't know very well the story. I heard something about-

[00:11:34.320] - Oliver (Host)

Apparently, the food is very salty. They put a lot of salt in the rest of the food, and the rest of the food has so much flavour. They say that the bread is supposed to be quite plain to complement the saltiness of the food and the flavour, some food. Well, but to be honest, I just miss the salt in the bread. With my Philistine palate-

[00:11:56.750] - César (Guest)

Your what palate?

[00:11:57.360] - Oliver (Host)

Philistine, lacking cultural awareness or anything like that. I'm missing… I don't understand the point of having tasteless bread to go with tasty food when you could have tasty bread to go with tasty food. But I'm sure that is my failing. I'm not Tuscan and not Tuscan cooking, even though I really, really, really want the salt back. So yeah, I miss Spanish bread. Exactly. Changing the subject completely, but staying within the theme of holidays. I think we might have done an episode on holidays before, but I can't remember. One of the risks of going on holiday is realising that actually being in close proximity to some of your friends for days on end is actually not something you want to see. They say that it's very bad to go on holiday with friends sometimes. Very bad to live with friends because you might end up with no friends. What do you think about that? Both in general and then in this holiday?

[00:12:57.320] - César (Guest)

I don't think it's applicable to this holiday. In general, I've heard of groups of friends going on holiday together and ending up arguing.

[00:13:07.030] - Oliver (Host)

Having a fight.

[00:13:07.730] - César (Guest)

Having a fight.

[00:13:08.790] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah. Has it happened to you?

[00:13:10.490] - César (Guest)

No, I don't think that has ever happened to me. But I think the biggest holiday I've done with a big group of people was when I was 20. At the university, it was 10 of us.

[00:13:21.450] - Oliver (Host)

How many of those people do you still talk to, César?

[00:13:24.500] - César (Guest)

One. Half.

[00:13:26.500] - Oliver (Host)

Half. This is when you open Instagram and you see that those nine people have gone on holiday together.

[00:13:34.090] - César (Guest)

Yeah, exactly. No, it was a very pleasant holiday in Budapest.

[00:13:39.040] - Oliver (Host)

Okay. Yeah.

[00:13:40.060] - César (Guest)

But I guess it's difficult. I think if you decide to go on holiday with a group of people, with a group of friends, you need to be flexible, right? You need to compromise a lot. You need to accommodate their likings. Because some people like the beach, some people like the mountains, some people like going for restaurants. Some people like going out. You don't need to do everything together as well.

[00:14:06.200] - Oliver (Host)

Well, no. I suppose different people feel different ways about that, don't they? Because sometimes people do want to do everything together and they feel like you're being antisocial if you say, Do you know what, guys? I'm going to stay inside today and just relax. They feel like, What's the point of going on holiday if you're not going to hang out together the whole time? You do get different... I'm not naturally, I would say, that outgoing a person. I can fake it, but I feel quite exhausted at the end of a day of being really sociable.

[00:14:35.890] - César (Guest)

I'm even less sociable, probably. My social battery runs out very quickly.

[00:14:41.470] - Oliver (Host)

I think you're better at being consistent, whereas I think I spark and then disappear. We will go out for dinner where I will start off doing a lot of the socialising for us, and then I basically just slump in my seat.

[00:14:56.220] - César (Guest)

Hiding behind the table.

[00:14:58.700] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah. Exactly. I think that I explode and then retire, and you are more consistent across the whole evening.

[00:15:06.960] - César (Guest)

Maybe.

[00:15:08.180] - Oliver (Host)

But I think also, you say that it's an advantage to be flexible, and I think that is true. But I've, no one's ever criticised me to my face, at least for insisting that we do something. But people have criticised me to my face for being too relaxed on holiday in the sense of going with the flow too much and allowing other people to take the decisions. People actually don't like taking decisions a lot of the time, do they? They want someone else to make the decision for them.

[00:15:37.680] - César (Guest)

Yeah, but I also feel that those people who don't like making the decision, sometimes if you try to make decisions, they feel slightly threatened because you're making too many decisions. In the sense that I understand that decision fatigue exists, and it's important to help and coordinate and make the plan together. But sometimes you just don't really care. You prefer that someone do it for you, but then you cannot complain either, if you're not contributing to the planning of the holidays. So, I don't know.

[00:16:15.880] - Oliver (Host)

We're in Italy this weekend. In July, we're going to France. We're also going to go - staying in Spain - to go and see my sister, who lives in Saudi Arabia. She is coming to Catalonia, so we'll see her. Everything that we're doing this summer is very European. I don't think… We've never left Europe together, have we?

[00:16:39.710] - Oliver (Host)

No. In 8 years.

[00:16:42.840] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, I think the last time I left Europe, I think, was in 2016, 2017, when I went to South Korea.

[00:16:51.680] - César (Guest)

Cuba in 2017?

[00:16:53.860] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah, sorry, 2017. I went to Cuba. That's the last time that I've left.

[00:16:57.210] - César (Guest)

In my case, was 2011, when I got the grant to study English for three weeks in New York.

[00:17:05.140] - Oliver (Host)

We're being accidentally quite environmentally friendly, aren't we?

[00:17:07.990] - César (Guest)

Yeah.

[00:17:08.270] - Oliver (Host)

Where everyone is like, Don't have long haul flights.

[00:17:10.680] - César (Guest)

Learn from the example, Taylor.

[00:17:12.740] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah. Your obsession with Taylor Swift and her private jet. Where would you like to go if we could go anywhere outside of Europe?

[00:17:20.920] - César (Guest)

Japan.

[00:17:21.050] - Oliver (Host)

The big thing, I think, is money. That's interesting.

[00:17:23.570] - César (Guest)

Now that we got a Japanese friend.

[00:17:26.150] - Oliver (Host)

Yeah. Well, someone on the holiday is from Japan, and she's invited us to-

[00:17:30.280] - César (Guest)

She lives in Tokyo.

[00:17:31.230] - Oliver (Host)

You know, I've always wanted to go to Japan, but it's so expensive to get there. So we'll have to look into-

[00:17:36.080] - César (Guest)

It's the kind of holidays you need to plan in advance, right?

[00:17:38.780] - Oliver (Host)

Exactly.

[00:17:39.360] - César (Guest)

Otherwise, it can get very expensive.

[00:17:41.210] - Oliver (Host)

Exactly. Japan might be maybe the next time we do one of these special episodes abroad.

[00:17:47.210] - César (Guest)

From Japan?

[00:17:47.820] - Oliver (Host)

From Japan, yeah.

[00:17:48.720] - César (Guest)

From that famous zebra crossing.

[00:17:51.950] - Oliver (Host)

Oh, the one where there's multiple and it's full of people. Yeah, we know nothing about [bleep].

[00:18:00.580] - César (Guest)

Sorry.

[00:18:00.990] - Oliver (Host)

I'm going to have to bleep that again.

[00:18:02.300] - César (Guest)

But I said in Spanish.

[00:18:04.010] - Oliver (Host)

Still, this is an international podcast.

[00:18:06.670] - César (Guest)

It was a very threatening mosquito. It was green.

[00:18:09.330] - Oliver (Host)

I'm not sure it was mosquito.

[00:18:11.880] - César (Guest)

I'm sorry, biologist.

[00:18:13.320] - Oliver (Host)

I think that you're not the best at this. Okay, so, César, thank you very much for chatting to me in the roasting Tuscan sun. I'm definitely going to be… I've been so good, but I'm definitely now going to be burnt after this.

[00:18:27.190] - César (Guest)

Yeah.

[00:18:27.960] - Oliver (Host)

So thank, thank you very much, listener, for listening. Thank you. Please send me an email. If you have any questions or comments or anything, you can reach me at oliver@morethanalanguage.com. I look forward to hearing from you. As always, you can find the transcript online at www.morethanalanguage.com. That transcript is free, and you can also find at the same web address free flashcards, which will help you to practise and learn the most difficult vocabulary and phrases that we are going to be using in this episode.

[00:19:03.110] - Oliver (Host)

No, no, no, don't be silly, Claudia. I'll just cut you out.

[00:19:09.060] - Oliver (Host)

So you can use those flashcards, this free resource, to practise the most difficult vocabulary and phrases in today's episode. And until next time, when we'll be back in Valencia and doing something more normal. Thank you very much.

[00:19:25.290] - César (Guest)

Bye.